I have received some feedback on my previous Linux post talking about a commercial product for Linux called Cross Over published by Codeweavers. According to their web site, they are a “leading corporate backer of the Wine Project.” Their product works “by packaging Wine into an easy-to-use product.” It comes in different versions for the Mac, Linux desktop, and Linux Server, with the desktop version coming in a standard (6 months of limited support, comes with a free trial version: $40) and pro (enhanced deployability features, multi-user support, and 12 months of higher level support: $70) flavors. For the law office or any other business buying in volume, there are discounts. The idea here is to create a product that is “Wine on steroids” and easy to install. The question is, does it get us our “must-have apps” on Linux?
Sadly, the answer appears to be no. The Codeweavers site contains an excellent list of law-related apps and a rating of how well they run under Cross Over. These ratings run from Gold (applications that install and run as you would expect them to in Microsoft Windows) to Untested (Codeweavers has not tested the application, they do not know if they will work, and they do not support them). The problem is, every single law-related app is rated as Untested. At best, on another list, QuickBooks is rated Bronze. Also, for those who want to stay with MS Office and do not trust OpenOffice on file format compatibility, Office 1997-2000 has a Gold rating, Office XP Silver, and Office 2003 Bronze. Please don’t misunderstand me; this looks to be an excellent product maintained by a company dedicated to extending the Wine product to as many apps as possible. I will check this list periodically to see how it shapes up. You can also look for yourself and search their site to see how your mission-critical application runs. The answer to the question I posted, therefore, is: Yes, they will get us closer, and we may even arrive in the near future. The problem is, we aren’t there yet.
July 15, 2007 at 6:11 pm
Don’t give up the ship!
Unfortunately you won’t find direct replacements for a lot of the law specific stuff (bummer). The question you have to ask yourself is — does it need to be ON the desktop or laptop? It if doesn’t then move those apps to a MS Server (or MS Terminal Server) Then use RDP2 to provide access to those apps on an as needed basis onto the linux desktop.
For a sole practicing lawyer probably not practical. But for even a 4-5 person firm this kind of shared arrangement makes sense. Share those resources that not everybody uses all the time and reduce your licensing costs.
July 15, 2007 at 9:40 pm
As I mentioned in my original post, Linux can provide very stable servers for zero licensing cost. It really becomes a cost question for having the Linux consultant, i.e. is the cost of the consultant plus the cheaper server hardware less than the more expensive hardware for the server and the license package for the MS Server software? If it is the former, then Linux would be a viable option as you describe. My experience, however, is that attorneys in small firms use peer-to-peer setups for networks and want to use familiar Windows software. It is a bias that needs to be overcome, but in order to do that, the Linux world ha to show them that they can accomplish the same thing for less without describing it in terms and acronyms that they never heard of. Tell them that it is just like Windows for a lot less, and open source/Linux will really have arrived. Look how long it took to get them beyond the “computers are for staff” mentality to get the machines on their desks in the first place?
July 16, 2007 at 12:09 am
Excuse my ignorence, but did you actually try any of the applications listed on the site. I use Crossover Office my self and run a number of applications listed as untested on the website and they run without problems.
Perhaps no one has bothered to update these applications on the list, or no one has botherd to try them on Crossover Office.
Perhaps if you try the applications, then they may run perfectly using Crossover Office, if this is the case then you can change the application in the database to reflect the functionality.
July 16, 2007 at 2:28 am
Tuxedup: Quite frankly, my understanding is that Cross Over is a commercial product that markets itself as a way to run Windows apps on Linux. As someone looking to see if Linux (and their product) would benefit the small law office, I read about their product on their site and relied on the information they posted as to what applications will run successfully. IMHO it is up to that company to test applications and maintain the data on their site as to what applications will run and with what degree of success, on THEIR product, not mine. They should certainly do that if they want people to try their product (let alone pay money for it). It should not be up to the user to test the product, then update the vendor’s site, at least not in a commercial setting. I will certainly try to check their site periodically for updates, but . . .
July 17, 2007 at 1:40 am
If you expressed interest in a particular product, they may very well increase the attention they give to test that product. It’s up to you if it is that important to you. Just like you could let the application makers know you are interested in them supporting Linux natively so as to bypass CrossOver altogether. Supply and Demand sometimes works.
July 17, 2007 at 2:24 am
I have tested PCLaw with Crossover. It was a waste of time. Besides, as someone who chooses to use open source software, why would I want to buy a proprietary program just so that I can run more proprietary programs? Crossover Office is something you use as a backup for those times when you need absolute compatibility with MS Office documents. And you can get much better all around compatibility by purchasing a Windows license and running it in a virtual machine. It’s still not something I would do unless absolutely necessary.
But these law practice software packages are nothing but over-hyped databases. I don’t believe they provide anything that can’t be done with MS Access or OpenOffice.org Base. At some point, I would like to create my own custom system using OOo Base.
Unfortunately, OpenOffice.org Base in Ubuntu Feisty still has some major bugs with forms creation. Supposedly they are fixed in Ubuntu Gutsy, but that is in beta and isn’t due for release until this October.
If I really needed law practice management software, I would still be using Windows. Fortunately in my solo practice, email, a calendar and a Word Processor are all I really need.
Steven, have you looked into GnuCash for accounting? The latest versions are quite good.
July 17, 2007 at 3:08 am
In my (in this case rather painful) experience, XOffice is a fine product provided the support is labeled GOLD. In other cases it is _not_ suitable for any corporate production deployment. Moreover, the host machine, must not be too old, as XOffice plus the Win-app tend to hog resources.
In general, I would recommend looking for a Linux-based comparable application, even if it requires some re-training. As I mentioned in a reply to your earlier post, I’d replace Quicken with e.g., Quasar, webERP or SQLledger. As for law-related apps, I cannot say; these are outside of my area of expertise.
I would suggest looking for related FOSS projects and provide their developers with some “incentive” in the form of sponsorship or subcontract that could expedite the evolution of said project to meet your needs. In this manner you can support FOSS, have your name, or that of your Firm appear in the credits and help pave the way to easier adoption of Linux in the Law Offices at large.
Bottom line, there must be a compelling reason to want to switch to Linux. The process will require re-training and re-evaluation of existing practices, thus in the short term the transition will be disruptive; although a well planned and staged migration plan may minimize this disruption. At the end of the day the benefits _must_ outweigh the costs.
July 17, 2007 at 4:03 am
If Codeweavers’ rates an application as untested it means just that. It hasn’t been tested, it doesn’t mean it won’t work. It means that it may or may not work.
If you don’t want to their out their product for this specifc Windows applications why don’t you try them out on plain vanilla Wine. They might just work. That’s what I have done with the few windows programs I run.
July 17, 2007 at 4:03 am
Some of the law apps aren’t that big; perhaps a few law firms could bunch together and hire a couple of foss developers to build new ones that’ll work on all platforms or be web based; have companies never done co-operative organisation under a certain banner or name?
July 17, 2007 at 4:24 am
Steven, then you don’t ‘get’ open source and even though Code Weaver is a commercial entity, they are based on an open source product( WINE ).
FYI, in open source, you have a say in what goes on and the whole thing works better if you actually say/do something. So in the open source world, having users try things out and feeding back information on what’s good/bad/ugly is how the product gets better. Just sitting on your tookas waiting to see if/when someone else tests your application of interest is not going to get you or the product( WINE ) anywhere.
Open source if very different from proprietary commercial software in this way. Often, even one voice can make a difference in OSS while one squeaking voice to a proprietary company will be lucky to get past the SPAM filter, let alone the first level of support.
Here’s to hoping you make the effort to see what works and what doesn’t work and then send them feedback on your results. Personally, I’ve found QuickBooks works just fine in WINE for us.
July 17, 2007 at 4:40 am
Folks: Thank you all for your comments. They helped me to understand this better. However, please realize that most solos and small firms (in my experience) just want a tech solution they know will work to help them run their business and practice law more effectively; they don’t want to participate in the open source project. That said, I hope more firms DO participate, as that will make Linux a more viable option in the law firm marketplace. If you have information on Linux alternatives for Windows products, I would love to hear about it. Please e-mail them to me at sksteve_at_comcast.net, and I will consider them for future posts. With that, due to limited time to moderate comments (I am a full-time practicing attorney ) I am closing this post to comments.
July 18, 2007 at 12:00 am
[...] Will Codeweavers Get Us Closer to a Linux Law Office? I have received some feedback on my previous Linux post talking about a commercial product for Linux called Cross Over […] [...]
February 23, 2009 at 10:47 pm
[...] how it can really replace Windows or Mac in the law office (outside the server) without using Wine, Crossover, or VMWare for verticle market legal apps like case management or bankruptcy software. However, I [...]